How to Mix Wet Dough by Hand [Video]

(Originally Published February 22, 2016 by Trevor Wilson)

(Update: I now call this method of mixing the “Rubaud Method” because I learned it from the great baker Gerard Rubaud. He deserves the credit for this technique, not me.)

How to mix high hydration dough? It’s a question that plagues many home bakers (and more than a few professionals, as well). For some, the answer is to throw it into the mixer and let the machine do the work. And that’s fine. It’ll do the job well.

But . . .

What if you don’t have a mechanical mixer? What if you prefer to mix by hand? What if you don’t want to incorporate a ton of flour into the dough by kneading it on the bench in the traditional manner? What do you do then?

Well, in that case, it seems you’ve only got a couple options:

Slap and Fold

Or . . .

Stretch and Fold

Both can work quite nicely, but both come with their own problems.

Slap and Fold can develop a wet dough very quickly. It’ll make a silky smooth dough with great strength in no time at all. After only a few minutes of Slap and Fold you’ll have a dough that looks like it came straight from a commercial mixer.

Of course, you’ll also have bits of dough stuck to the ceiling, the refrigerator, and in your hair. You’ll have to scrape your bench or counter clean. And you may very well have a headache from the constant pounding inherent in the process.

If, like me, you’re of the opinion that bread making should be a pleasant endeavor, then Slap and Fold probably ain’t gonna cut it for you.

So your other option is Stretch and Fold.

This certainly fixes the problems of mess and headache. And thank God for that. But simply developing the dough through stretching and folding brings it’s own problems. For one, there’s the very real possibility that the folding won’t be enough to fully develop the dough.

We’re told that just stretching and folding the dough over a few hours of bulk fermentation is enough to develop the dough to the appropriate strength, but does it?

Well, the answer is yes . . . and no.

Or more accurately, the answer is “sometimes, but not always.”

You see, dough is quite the mystery. And what works one day might not work the next. So it may be that Stretch and Fold is enough to develop your dough 9 times out of 10. Ninety percent is pretty good, I won’t argue with that.

But if you bake often, that’s just not enough.

In a professional bakery, if one out of every ten batches of dough were poorly mixed, that would constitute a serious problem. A very serious problem. And the mixer responsible would have some real ‘splainin’ to do.

No. Ninety percent is not good enough.

Now that’s plenty reason for me to look for something better, but there’s still another problem with Stretch and Fold . . . .

Sometimes, just sometimes, you can’t get everything mixed into the dough evenly.

What do I mean by that?

The most common difficulty lies in getting the starter and/or salt fully incorporated into the dough. Sure, reserving some water to include when you add your salt goes a long way towards fixing the salt problem. And if you keep a liquid starter, that’s not much of a problem to work in either.

But what if you prefer a stiffer starter?

Well then, I suppose you’re just screwed. Because the truth is that trying to fully incorporate a stiff starter into a batch of dough using only stretch and folds is a real problem. I guess you might need to reserve some more water to help soften the starter before mixing it in.

And don’t even get me started on trying to add ingredients like dried fruit or nuts. Now you’re in for some real working of the dough.

But at what point does this defeat the purpose of Stretch and Fold? When does stretching and folding turn into plain ‘ol mixing?

If you’re gonna be mixing, then best just mix and get it over with.

So here’s your alternative. My preferred way of hand-mixing wet, high hydration dough.

Clean. Quiet. Gentle. Easy.

And thorough.

No more worrying if the salt and starter are mixed in fully. They are.

No more worrying if the dough is developed enough. It is.

No noise. No mess.

Just beautiful dough and the joy of making it.

If you’ve been happy using Slap and Fold or Stretch and Fold, then by all means continue to do so. But if you’ve been less than 100% satisfied with either, then give my method a try. It might surprise you.

Cheers!

Trevor J. Wilson

Original comments no longer active.

Comments

1. Sarah Kurniawan saysApril 11, 2016 at 1:17 AMthis video makes me incredibly happyReply
   • Trevor Wilson saysApril 11, 2016 at 6:54 AMThank you Sarah, I’m glad you enjoyed it.Cheers!TrevorReply
     • roger harmon saysJanuary 14, 2017 at 7:10 PMTrevor your videos are exceptional can you cover final proof times I live in the sub tropics of Australia our tem is around 35c most days and 90% humidity most of the time I also bake straight from fridge after 18 hours proof but not 100 % happy so can I have some help please regards Roger.Reply
2. JY saysApril 27, 2016 at 2:43 AMgreat video, thanks a lot!question on pre-shaping, how is it that your dough doesn’t stick to the bench knife? i have difficulty using bench knife because the wet dough tends to stick to it to the point i decided to no longer use it.Reply
   • Trevor Wilson saysApril 27, 2016 at 2:01 PMHi JY, I’m glad you like the video. Without being there in person to see why the dough is sticking to your bench knife it’s hard for me to say exactly what’s going on. Bench knives are fairly non-stick by nature. The only thing that comes to mind is perhaps a lack of tension as you’re pre-rounding.Let me explain . . .Dough is far less sticky when it’s holding tension as opposed to when it’s relaxed. My bench knife does in fact stick to the dough a little bit, but only on the first pass — before it’s really tightened up. Once that lump of dough starts to form the shape of a boule and hold some tension that’s when the blade ceases to stick. So it could just be that you’re not developing enough tension while pre-rounding. If that’s the case, then it’s likely just a technique issue that would be solved with more practice. I wasn’t able to pre-round cleanly like this on my first try (or second, or third, or fourth, etc.)If your technique is sound, but it’s still sticking then the only thing I can come up with is that your dough is simply too wet or underdeveloped. But again, I’d have to be there in person to tell for sure. I wish I had a better answer for you, but these kinds of issues really do require a set of eyes there in person. Let me know if you have any other thoughts on what’s going on and perhaps we could figure it out together. Cheers!TrevorReply
     • JY saysApril 28, 2016 at 11:47 AMHi Trevor,Thank you for the detailed response. I’ll have to keep that in mind. I do notice in some other bakings that it tend to be less sticky towards bench knife when the boule is shaped. Perhaps my stretch and fold needs to be better to create better tension as I am pre-shaping? I’ll have to try it again tonight. I usually wet my hands, but should I do the same for bench knife?ThanksJYReply
       • Trevor Wilson saysApril 29, 2016 at 8:23 AMHi JY, if you can create a bit more tension with your stretch and fold that might certainly help. And wetting the bench knife might help out a bit too. Give it a try and see. My guess is that with increased practice you’ll find it easier and easier to pre-shape the dough without the sticking becoming a problem.But, if after some time it seems things are not improving, then consider moving on to another technique. This method works well for me, but we each have to figure out what works best for ourselves individually. Best of luck!TrevorReply
3. Julie Martin saysMay 11, 2016 at 6:15 PMThis video was life changing! (I’m exaggerating a bit). 🙂 After your final folds, I see you put the dough into your proofing basket. Did you let it rise there? Double in size?I’m a newbie to SD, and I was making the fatal mistake of adding flour so it wouldn’t stick to my hands. Your informative and chill attitude about the dough increased my confidence in moving forward.Thanks.Reply
   • Trevor Wilson saysMay 12, 2016 at 9:23 AMHi Julie, I’m glad you liked the video! I do let the dough rise in the proofing basket. I don’t let it double — that’s usually a bit too much for wet dough like this. Maybe 80%-90% by eye, if I had to guess, but I mostly go by feel from lightly touching the loaf to gauge the surface tension. Determining the right moment to bake your loaf is a skill you’ll develop in time, but every newbie will go through some challenging days where they are either underproofing or overproofing. It’s just part of the learning process.As for adding flour, there’s nothing wrong with using flour on the bench or dough to help keep it from sticking. You don’t want to add too much and incorporate large clumps of flour into your loaf, but a light dusting is certainly acceptable. It’s hard to see in the video, but when I shape I have a very light dusting of flour on the bench, on the surface of the dough, and on my hands. I don’t use any flour when I pre-round, but that’s because I’ve practiced the technique you see in the video. Most bakers do use flour when they pre-round and, again, it’s perfectly ok to do so. So use it if you need it, but use only as much as you need. And over time try to reduce that amount as much a possible. Cheers!Reply
4. Antonio saysMay 21, 2016 at 5:39 PMCongratulations and thanks for posting the videos, Trevor.Reply
   • Trevor Wilson saysMay 21, 2016 at 6:22 PMYou’re very welcome, Antonio! Cheers!TrevorReply
5. Catia saysJune 8, 2016 at 9:00 PMsalve, vivo in Italia e trovo i suoi video fantastici! estremamente chiari e istruttivi. vorrei ringraziarla molto anche perchè il suo metodo è si efficace ma anche tanto rilassante, lei ha contribuito ad abbattere le mie ansie e spero di raggiungere migliori risultati panificando per la mia famiglia.. la seguirò con vero piacere. buona vita.Reply
   • Trevor Wilson saysJune 10, 2016 at 9:59 AMHi Catia, I don’t speak Italian, but with the help of Google Translate I managed to understand your comment. Grazie!TrevorReply
6. Catia saysJune 8, 2016 at 9:09 PMSignor Trevor sono entusiasta dei suoi video!!! le faccio i miei complimenti- potrei chiedere cosa lei mette nella padella (sembrano semi) prima di versarci il pane? grazie.Reply
   • Trevor Wilson saysJune 10, 2016 at 10:01 AMHi Catia, I use polenta. It helps me to slide the loaf around if I misplace it in the pan. Plus I like the flavor and “tooth” that it gives to the bottom crust. Cheers!TrevorReply
7. Zeina saysJune 9, 2016 at 4:33 PMHi TrevorThanks for the video! I am experimenting with 100% whole wheat sourdough, I was wondering if you have any advice on hydration level? I know it’ll need a high hydration level so I was thinking maybe a starter at 100% hydration and a pre-mix at 75 or 85% hydration?Reply
   • Trevor Wilson saysJune 10, 2016 at 10:09 AMHi Zeina, how much hydration to start with really depends upon the absorbency of your flour. The finer the grind the more water it’ll take. It’s really just a matter of trial and error. That said, it’s usually better to err on the side of too stiff than too wet. So maybe try 75% to start and see how it feels. Then you can adjust up or down depending on the results.Just a word of warning about using the premix method with 100% whole grain. The higher the amount of whole grain in a dough, the higher the enzymatic and wild fermentation activity will be. So it’s important not to let the dough sit out too long if the temperature is warm. I’ve used the premix method for 100% whole wheat to great success, but I make sure that it’s thoroughly chilled first and not left out at room temp for any more than 8-9 hours before I use it. If you do it right it’ll make for a more extensible and sweeter whole wheat, but if things go wrong you could end up with some off flavors, or perhaps an overly weak dough. Let me know how it turns out.Cheers!TrevorReply
     • Zeina Fakhereddin saysJune 25, 2016 at 6:26 AMHey TrevorI tried the pre-mix method which I leave overnight for about 8 hours with 100% whole wheat at 75% hydration. The dough and flavour turn out great, but I have two questions.First, I’m not getting enough oven-spring, my loaf comes out quite flat. What do you suggest I change?Also, I do a series of three stretch and folds before shaping, which takes about 3 hours. I feel this is more than enough time, but I’m not exactly sure. What’s a good way to know that the dough is ready for shaping?Thanks a lot!ZeinaReply
       • Trevor Wilson saysJune 27, 2016 at 9:06 AMHi Zeina, if your dough is great, but you’re not getting much ovenspring then that is often a result of underproofed dough. You can tell if your dough is underproofed if it spreads instead of holding shape. For instance, if it spreads out like a pancake when you preround your loaf that means that it was underproofed during your bulk. The same can be true for spreading when you turn it out to bake — if it spreads wide instead of standing proud then it was underproofed. Now, if it deflates and loses gas that means that it was actually overproofed. But assuming your dough wasn’t overproofed here are some tips . . .1) Make sure your dough rises at least 30% in volume during the bulk proof. 50% might be better. If your dough doesn’t develop enough gas during the bulk proof then it won’t contain the necessary structure to help support the dough after shaping. If your dough isn’t rising during bulk fermentation then . . .2) It might be a simple matter of letting it proof longer and/or warmer. But it might also mean that your starter isn’t active enough to properly raise dough. An active starter should at least double in volume within 8 hours after refreshment (tripling in volume is even better). If your starter won’t double within 8 hours of feeding then that means you have a sluggish starter. You will need to adjust your feeding/maintenance routine in order to bring back up to full vigor.3) Premixing high portion whole grain breads can be a bit risky since they are so much more prone to enzymatic overactivity and spontaneous fermentation. The gluten might start degrading and the dough may develop off flavors. Since you said the dough and flavor turned out great I’m guessing this isn’t the problem. But if your dough tears very easily or doesn’t hold together well then that’s a sign that you had some overactive enzymes during the overnight rest.4) 100% whole wheat bread will never get as much ovenspring as white bread will. Never. It’s very common for 100% whole wheat to get very little ovenspring — even when the dough feels great and the proofing was just right. It’s simply the nature of whole wheat. You can improve the performance by using finely ground whole wheat as opposed to a courser grind, but you’re still not going to see much ovenspring in comparison to a white bread. Any baker who makes 100% whole wheat must resign them self to substantially lower ovenspring and reduced loaf volume. It’s just par for the course.I hope that helps out. Best of luck!TrevorReply
         • Zeina Fakhereddin saysJune 28, 2016 at 10:09 AMThanks so much Trevor, I really appreciate it!Reply
8. Mark saysJuly 13, 2016 at 6:10 AMHello, great video. I do quite the same to develop dough but I’m really curious about your cooking method.You put the final shape in the proofing basket and when raised you put it in a pan.Is the dough doubled? or less? or more?
   The pan is hot?
   Tha pan has a cover in the first step of cooking? What is the function of the pan?Thanks!Reply
   • Trevor Wilson saysJuly 13, 2016 at 8:24 AMHi Mark, glad you liked the video! The loaf was definitely not doubled in volume when I turned it out for baking. If I had to guess, I’d say it was maybe an 85% increase or so. But that really is a guess.The pan I use is a Lodge Cast Iron Combo Cooker (not an affiliate link). It comes with a lid that I covered it with off camera. I preheat the entire thing (pan and lid) for about an hour before I turn out my dough into it.The purpose of the pan is to emulate the effects of a masonry oven. The cast iron absorbs the heat from the oven then rapidly transfers that heat into the dough when it starts baking. Additionally, the lid traps steam that’s released from the baking dough which humidifies the air and allows the surface of the loaf to remain soft and pliable while the dough springs in the oven. It’s basically just a simple way of steaming the loaf without having to mess around trying to create steam in your oven. It’s not necessary to use this, but it’s simple and effective. The end result is bread that’s very similar in appearance and characteristics to a loaf baked from a professional masonry oven.I hope that helps. Cheers!TrevorReply
9. Stefan Stefanov saysAugust 14, 2016 at 7:53 AMhi there! I need a recepe for a sourdough starter. can you help me?Reply
   • Trevor Wilson saysAugust 14, 2016 at 10:03 AMHi Stefan, I certainly can help you. I don’t have any starter recipes posted here on my website, but I can point you in the right direction. The best tutorial I’ve seen for making sourdough starters can be found over at theperfectloaf.com. Here’s a link . . .https://www.theperfectloaf.com/7-easy-steps-making-incredible-sourdough-starter-scratch/You’ll find the article is simple, effective and beautifully photographed. It’ll get you started on the right foot. Good luck!Cheers!TrevorReply
10. Dean saysAugust 24, 2016 at 1:40 PMAwesome video, Trevor! Question: Seeing as fermentation is an anaerobic process, what is the advantage of mixing air into the dough?Thanks,
    DeanReply
    • Trevor Wilson saysAugust 30, 2016 at 11:45 AMThanks Dean! The advantage to mixing in air isn’t so much for the benefit of fermentation as it is for the benefit of the gluten development. Oxidation (to a degree) makes for stronger gluten. This is one of the primary reasons most flour is bleached, and why so many dough conditioners are oxidants. So by incorporating air into the dough, we help it to fully develop and form strong gluten.Cheers!TrevorReply
11. Arthur saysSeptember 6, 2016 at 3:28 PMgreat video, even if i am a bit late to the party.I gave this technique a go today with an 85% hydration sprouted wheat dough.
    when you were shown this method did you ever use it on larger volumes of dough? I just made a 2kg batch and felt i had a good workout (I don’t get much exercise, other than cycling to work).Reply
    • Trevor Wilson saysSeptember 11, 2016 at 11:32 AMThanks Arthur! This kind of mixing can definitely be a workout for the shoulders. But like any exercise, the more often you do it the easier it becomes. I’ve never personally used it for a large batch of dough, but I know of folks who have. In fact, you can watch Gerard himself using this method for a fairly good size batch of dough. I don’t know exactly how big the batch is, but I’d guess at least 10-12 kilos. Here’s a link for you . . .https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DGmsqnKRUb0Best of luck!TrevorReply
12. Gitte Poulsen saysOctober 17, 2016 at 11:53 PMHi Trevor,Loved the video!
    But hov many times – and with how long time apart – do you fold? You go from no. 1 to 3 without any explanation.. and so on.Could you please list it for me? I would so much love to make this bread!!PS: Could it be made in to buns as well?Best regards,Gitte (from Denmark) ?Reply
    • Trevor Wilson saysOctober 19, 2016 at 11:04 AMHi Gitte, for this particular batch of dough the fold schedule looked like this: 1) after 30 minutes, 2) after 1 hour, 3) after 90 minutes, 4) after 2 hours, 5) after 3 hours, 6) after 4 hours, 7) after 5 hours, 8) after 5 1/2 hours.Typically, with wet dough such as this, I fold it every 30 minutes for the first 2 hours then I fold it hourly after that. But it’s important to remember that there are no hard and fast rules here. You have to respond to the dough in hand. Folding is more art than science. For this batch of dough I decided that it needed an extra bit of strength and so I gave it that extra 8th fold just a half-hour after the seventh. I wasn’t planning on it, but I could tell by the way the dough felt that it needed it. This is just something that comes with experience.So, don’t feel that you need to be rigid with your folding schedule. The key is to find something that works well both for the dough and for you. Always adjust as necessary.Cheers!TrevorReply
13. Phyllis saysOctober 19, 2016 at 11:50 AMI live in SF ( historically a sourdough town ) and began making sourdough bread about 10 years ago using the wonderful recipe by Nancy Silverton and over the years have tried other recipes and techniques. Your videos and your writings about your techniques are comprehensive, thorough and exceptionally well presented.
    My first attempt was a bit “flat” but I took your advice and extended the proof time resulting in a loaf this morning with very satisfying oven spring. Thank you for sharing your expertise . My lucky friends and family for whom I bake bread thank you, too.Reply
    • Trevor Wilson saysOctober 21, 2016 at 9:27 AMThanks Phyllis! I’m glad to hear you managed to make the method work for you! These things are always a matter of calibration — it usually takes a few tries before one begins to figure it out. Like much of life really. Sounds like you’ve got plenty of experience backing you up so my guess is you calibrate quickly. You have a lucky family indeed!Cheers!TrevorReply
14. Kat saysNovember 17, 2016 at 6:16 PMHi Trevor!Thanks for your videos and instagram posts. I am trying to teach myself the art of bread making, and your posts are both inspiring and very helpful.I’m an experienced chef, but have never been trained professionally in baking. I’m really fascinated by the science of it all – it is obviously extremely nuanced and I know that a lot will come with practice, but I’m hoping to find some help troubleshooting.Through all of the reading I’ve done, I have generally had a hard time finding anyone who explains the importance of and role of initial mixing in the final product. I’m never sure if I’m over mixing, under mixing, etc. etc.. I understand that I need to develop the gluten network and generally handle it gently to get an open crumb. No matter how many pieces of advice I’ve followed from experts, I cannot seem to get the crumb I want to see. Lots and lots of exceptional sandwich bread! But I really, really want to figure out what I’m doing wrong.I’ve been playing around with the mixing technique in your vid for my last two bakes, and the benefits I’ve found are much better initial extensibility and better shape/score (my bakes prior to the ones using this mixing technique resulted in flatter loaves and dough dragging a lot under the lamé).But sadly, I still didn’t get the crumb openness that I wanted… My recent bake is posted in stages on my IG @cocokatpdx… Seemed beautiful right after mixing, and then seemed to lose extensibility and gain too much elasticity through stretch and fold over five hours. I think I did six S&F in the bowl and the 7th as part of preshape. Final dough temp was 75F before retarding overnight.Granted, I used high percentage whole grain, but I’ve seen plenty of examples of whole wheat/grain breads out there with very open crumb. Oven spring didn’t really seem to be a problem, but I know not to expect as much as white flour breads (as you mentioned in your previous comments).Any ideas? Should I have handled it less or not at all during bulk ferment? Or maybe my starter is weaker than I think it is?Long comment… sorry! One of these days I need to go to some workshops and get some hands on instruction.Thanks for any and all feedback 🙂Reply
    • Trevor Wilson saysNovember 21, 2016 at 10:45 AMHi Kat, after reviewing your IG gallery, I can’t find any particular thing that you’re doing wrong. Of course, my info is limited to just a few visuals and your description so I certainly don’t have a complete picture. But here’re some things to consider . . .1) Your dough looks very nice. I think you’re doing just fine on the mixing front. But I can see how it has become much less extensible by the time you are shaping it. It may be that you’re folding a bit too much, but I think the main problem is that the whole grain you use has continued to soak up water as the dough proofs. By the time you get to shaping, you’re effectively working with a much stiffer dough.It’s very common for whole grains to continue soaking up water for many hours after initial mixing. This is especially true if the whole grains are of a particularly fine grind. Often times it becomes necessary to anticipate this effect and compensate by making your dough initially wetter than you might want. There’s really no science to it, just trial and error using the same recipe and same flour — eventually you’ll figure out the mix and become skilled at adjusting the hydration as necessary.2) Because you’re using a high portion of whole grain, that will inevitably make for a tighter crumb structure. I know there are bakers who can get a very nice crumb from high percentage whole grain breads, but truth be told, they are few and far between. I don’t mean that to be discouraging, but you need to have reasonable expectations. Those bakers who can achieve open crumb with whole grains are typically very experienced production bakers — they’ve been working with those same breads at high volume for years at a time. They are experts at what they do.That’s not to say you can’t achieve that goal. Just be mindful of where you fall along the spectrum of experience. Expertise takes a long time to develop — far longer than most realize. Your bread looks very good to me. So you’re doing quite well. You just need patience — your skills will develop in time.3) And on a related note, you’re making the challenge of open crumb more difficult for yourself by focusing on high percentage whole grain breads. I understand that this is the kind of bread you want to make, both for flavor and for health, but you’re essentially handicapping yourself when it comes to developing open crumb.Now, in my view, open crumb should never be the end goal. So long as your loaf is flavorful and well-risen then you’ve succeeded. But, in this era of open crumb obsession we live in, I understand your desire. If it’s truly a goal that matters to you, then you’d be better served by practicing on white breads. It’s unrealistic to think that you can achieve a wide open crumb structure in whole grain breads if you can’t first achieve that structure with white breads. It’s just a simple matter of progression — master the basics first then move on to the harder stuff. At the very least, I suggest you add in a white bread or two to your baking rotation. You can always give the loaves to a neighbor if you’d rather not eat them, but the practice would be valuable.4) Continuing with the same theme, open crumb is 80% proper fermentation and dough handling. Both are skills, and like any skill it takes time and practice to become good at. Lots of time. Lots of practice. I think you’re off to a very good start. Keep at it and you’ll start to notice that fermentation becomes easier to judge, handling/shaping the dough becomes easier and that your crumb becomes more and more open along the way. There is no single trick to achieving open crumb, it’s an emergent quality of bread that comes from mastering the basics and from an accumulation of many little things. I wish you luck!Cheers!TrevorReply
15. Dan saysNovember 17, 2016 at 7:43 PMHi Trevor,
    Thank you very much for this site and all the videos!!!
    So, I do have some trouble with this one. It looks like I handle my dough pretty well until the pre-shaping phase (and the dough looks like yours, lots of elasticity). However, when I turn it on the work surface as you do at 6:19 in the video, it sticks to the surface and I’m not able to pre-shape it at all. In fact it looses tension instead of gaining it. I’m wondering, you say your hand is wet, but is your surface also wet? If not, what’s the secret to keep it from sticking? Could my dough be too wet? I wish I could send you a video so you can see what happens…Reply
16. Harris saysDecember 20, 2016 at 6:49 AMHi, I have one question.
    If I want to mix with a mixer what will I use?
    (I attach a picture because I am not sure of the names)
    http://cdn.averiecooks.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/11/Screen-Shot-2012-11-18-at-10.08.27-AM.pngA hook (the one in the middle) or paddle (left one)? Or it doesn’t matter?ThanksReply
    • Trevor Wilson saysDecember 21, 2016 at 4:52 PMYou’ll want to use the dough hook in the middle for mixing bread dough. The other two are meant more for mixing batter or whipping egg whites and such. Cheers!TrevorReply
17. Jim saysJanuary 9, 2017 at 9:53 PMWhat a generous sharing of knowledge. This has kicked by bread quality up by a significant degree. Thank you for sharing this with all of us. Bakers are the best!
    JimReply
    • Trevor Wilson saysJanuary 10, 2017 at 2:12 PMThanks Jim! I’m happy to share! Cheers!TrevorReply
18. Maja saysJanuary 11, 2017 at 8:36 AMHow long before I bake should I feed my starter? Many people say the night before.Reply
19. Patricia saysJanuary 28, 2017 at 12:10 AMDear TrevorIt’s because of you I have had success in baking lower hydration sourdough straight from the ‘fridge. Thank you!I attempted a high hydration bake, the dough was lovely and full of bubbles – and then I put it in the ‘fridge overnight – I think I over-proofed it. Result; no oven spring, flat bread (yet tasty and full of holes) How long should I leave it before baking? Your video looks as if you bake it immediately. How long did you leave it before baking?Thanks in anticipation.Reply
20. Perry saysFebruary 4, 2017 at 9:15 PMHi,Trevor.
    I love your clear & concise method,kudos!
    I only have a counter convection toaster oven with 450 degrees max,so would i need to protect the bottom of the loaf from burning using sheet pans stacked on top of each other?(i don’t have much clearance,only 5″…)Plus,will your method of baking first 25 minutes at 500 would work at 450,or i’ll need more time ?
    Also,is it true that the bread’s interior temp when done should be around 210 degrees?
    Few times when i just made french bread parts of the inside crum weren’t completely bakes-solution?
    Thank you once again for your excellent tutorial.Reply
21. Umberto saysJuly 26, 2017 at 8:34 AMHi Trevor,
    Your videos are extremely interesing, they are packed with very valuable information. Thank you very much.Reply
22. Kate saysNovember 18, 2017 at 8:45 AMHi Trevor….I just stumbled on your video and immediately bought the e-book. It will be my guilty pleasure this weekend! Meanwhile, just a quick question about the recipe you posted in a window of the video. Your finished product looked so gorgeous that I’d like to try making it. You mention 22g each whole wheat, spelt, and rye. Are the berries meant to be used whole, or ground? I know that your book doesn’t focus on recipes, but I figured that since you included one in the video you would be able to provide advice. Looking forward to digging into my first wet dough! Thanks….Reply
    • Trevor Wilson saysNovember 18, 2017 at 8:41 PMThank you Kate! I hope you like the book! To answer your question, the spelt and the rye (and the whole wheat, for that matter) were whole ground flour. I wish you success with your first wet dough — but be warned, it’s a challenge. But a fun one. Best of luck!Cheers!TrevorReply
23. Gonzalo saysNovember 19, 2017 at 2:59 PMhey trevor! about folds, im curious, more folds adds more streght so more tight the dough will be, so should be less oven spring? I found that when I make 6/8 folds I get a flat bread. But with less folds (2/3) my bread rise much more in the oven. But I dont know if thats the reason because there are so many other variables…Reply
    • Trevor Wilson saysDecember 4, 2017 at 7:12 PMHey Gonzalo, you are correct that more folds generally creates more strength. But that’s not something that usually limits ovenspring. In fact, stronger dough usually has better ovenspring than weaker dough. I can’t think of any reason that your dough would turn out flatter because of using more folds — unless you are also proofing the dough longer and it begins to overproof or overferment. Like you said, there are many many variables at play so it could be something else entirely. I would have to be there in person to see what’s going on before I could give you a more accurate answer. That said, if you see a pattern whereby you get better bread with fewer folds then it’s probably best that you use fewer folds. Whatever works best for you is what works best.Cheers!TrevorReply
24. Ben saysJanuary 16, 2018 at 10:37 AMThank you Trevor for the great post! I have been working on a 100% whole wheat sourdough for about a year now (about 2 loaves per week), and every time I think I’m almost there but I’m still not there yet and not sure I ever will be 🙂 But that’s part of the fun I suppose. The dough is pretty wet (100% hydration though also whole wheat), and I’ve been doing a long overnight room temperature autolyse to try to naturally develop the gluten. Then I do perhaps 3 or 4 folds during the bulk fermentation. Essentially trying to develop the gluten with as little working of the dough as possible, with the theory that this will prevent the bran from tearing the gluten structure. I typically bulk until the dough feels aerated in my hands during the folding (perhaps 30% increased in volume though hard to tell). Then do a final proof around 3 or 4 hours at room temperature (I realize retarding will solve some of the problems, but don’t like the sourness of retarted dough and don’t like how it leaks out so much water onto the cloth). The dough almost doubles in size during the final proof and still has a bit of springiness to it, but it always spreads out when I load it. It’s difficult to score (creates jagged lines) and has a moderate spring but not great. The end bread is tasty and moderately airy, but it’s not very open, doesn’t have much vertical volume, and doesn’t have nicely opened scores. I’ve been telling myself for a while this is due to a lack in skill during the shapings. However, recently I’ve finally got my shaping skills at a decent level, so I don’t think this is it. The bread almost always fails the poke test, no matter if it’s been 1 hour or 4 hours of final proofing (springs back a little, but always leaves a permanent indentation). So I think this bread is inherently weak enough that the poke test is not reliable here. I guess the bread shows signs of being overproofed, even when I know it’s not (for example with a 1 hour final proof). My latest thought is that the gluten is not properly developed all the way, causing the dough to seem like it’s overproofed when it’s not. Perhaps I should do a thorough Rubaud mix before the bulk fermentation? If so, then should I scale back on the length of the autolyse? My other thought is that the dough is too extensible, although I have tried no autolyse and that didn’t turn out great (perhaps because the gluten was underdeveloped). Any other thoughts? I realize this is a very difficult bread to make (100% whole wheat, wet, no retarding, and sourdough), but it’s the one I’m obsessed about making and I know that although it’s difficult it is possible. Thank you!Reply
25. Steve Galchutt saysAugust 9, 2018 at 1:35 PMFollowed your recipe to the nearest gram and my dough was like a soggy pancake mix aka very wet! Stretch-n-fold process was near impossible so I cut that short. I was surprised how far it would stretch yet being so wet! I then baked in a 8″ cast iron dutch oven (no lid) but lined with parchment paper to control the dough transfer and all placed in a larger dutch with lid in 500f for 30-min then removed loaf and another 10-min to fully brown crust. Rose double in size! Tasted AWESOME! I was fearful it was going to be a failure but hard to keep from cutting more “samples” while it cooled! Hah! Looked like large cup cake as the sides were supported by the 8″ DO while it baked! Living at 7,200′ I’m sure has it’s impact on baking. So next loaf will add less water to see if I can get a nice boule (dough ball) …signed by “Not Intimidated by Really Wet Dough!”Reply
26. Mark Lemire saysOctober 21, 2018 at 9:03 AMR.I.P. Monsieur Rubaud (1941 – 2018). I just learned this morning about the death of this great baker. I even used his technique learned here as taught by Trevor this morning while making my weekend loaves of bread. You will be missed but never forgotten.Reply
27. Michael Kessel saysNovember 4, 2018 at 9:29 AMHi Trevor, I really enjoyed reading and watching your blog. the final dough is beautiful. One question. With your method you expose the dough to a lot of air/oxygen. Possibly you even “incorporate” it. I would expect the oxidation of important ingredients of the flour, such as flavonoids, carotinoids etc. Do you think this is a point to consider? Could it be that your amazing crumb is the result of air, rather than CO2? Greetings fom Germany, Michael.Reply
28. Nick Butcher saysDecember 7, 2018 at 10:16 AMI had a genuine OMG moment when you opened up that loaf and showed the crumb.Kudos!Reply
29. John saysDecember 29, 2018 at 3:10 PMOk…. I HAVE FOUND MY BR AD GOD! My Teacher, My master to follow.
    After diligently (and exhaustingly) researching open crumb sourdough technique for over 100 days, (and probably 80 boules), I have found TREVOR.
    Now i bake Trevor Bread.
    Seriously, You have a unique combination of skills mastery & a gift for teaching. I know you haven’t forgotten how difficult it can be for a newbie.
    Yet you speak with a certain humility and yet all the confidence is there.
    I’ll be ordering your book (as soon as I get my laptop back from the shop.)
    I won’t be asking any of my dumb-ass questions in this comment as I’m a bit shy about adding to your already mountainous volume of questions coming in.
    Just had to express my appreciation for your sharing, teaching nature.
    Thank you Sir Wilson!
    (Oooh, I like the sound of that! SIR WILSON!)Reply
30. Melba McKee @Kitchen Folks saysJanuary 5, 2019 at 12:51 AMSuch an informative article you had shared.Thanks for sharing this information. You defined clearly about this process. These tips will help me for mix the wet dough correctly. Keep sharing this type of helpful articles. 🙂Reply